From Our Soundbooth | January 03, 2022

Hello and welcome to Miller Aud-cast, the Missouri Review podcast where we listen to and discuss the finalists for the 2021 Miller Audio Prize. Happy New Year, listeners, readers, writers, and friends. May 2022 look favorably on us as we try to put it all back together, or dismantle it with just purpose. We’re back with episode 42 of the Miller Aud-cast, featuring the latest finalist for the 2021 Miller Audio Prize in  Audio Documentary, “The History of Policing Black People in America – with David A. Love,” a segment from the podcast Black Guy White Guy Talking, from Elwyn Laud-Hammond and Zachary Watterson, featuring a conversation with David A. Love.

BGWGTalking was born of a friendship across color lines which developed between two fathers willing to deeply unpack truths and untruths and discuss the important personal impact race and race relations have on their lives. Elwyn Laud-Hammond and Zachary Watterson both live in Philadelphia and raise daughters who are about the same age. Elwyn is an appraiser and entrepreneur, and Zach is a Pushcart Prize-nominated writer who also works in construction.

The audio documentary “The History of Policing Black People in America – with David A. Love – BGWGTalking #10” is a segment of an episode from the podcast, ‘Black Guy White Guy Talking,’ originally published on September 24th, 2020.

In this segment they welcome distinguished professor, journalist, and commentator David A. Love to discuss American Policing; the history of law enforcement in America, the police as an occupying force, and the desperate need to transform racist and violent policing.

Guests for available episodes include the aforementioned CNN and MSNBC commentator David Love who also writes for CNN OpinionAl JazeeraAtlanta Black Star, and The Washington Post; the 2021 Kingsley Tufts Poetry Award-winning poet John Murillo; and the American historian and author Nell Irvin Painter.

Episode #10 from BGWGTalking was recorded on August 13, 2020 in the Point Breeze neighborhood of Philadelphia at Sounds Like Soma recording studio. Sound engineer Zack Hanni first cut the hour-long session, and then, in June 2021, another sound engineer, Avery Sharp, working from his home in Paris, condensed it.

National Book Award-winning novelist and MacArthur Fellow Charles Johnson did a drawing of Zach and Elwyn talking:

In addition to being a novelist, philosopher, Buddhist, martial artist, father, and grandfather, Charles Johnson is an award-winning political cartoonist, whose work appeared in his book Black Humor (1970), Half Past Nation Time (1972), and in the new book It’s Life As I See It: Black Cartoonists in Chicago, 1940 – 1980. That’s the companion book to the exhibit “Chicago Comics,” which included his drawings among those of other political cartoonists. The exhibit ran from June 19, 2021 to Oct. 3, 2021 at the Chicago Museum of Contemporary Art.


The BGWGTalking logo was created by artist Kendall Gilbert.

The beatmaker brainorchestra composed the beats: “Galaxy Tee” is the intro and “2 Sugars” the outro. BGWGTalking is available on Spotify, iTunes and Apple Music.

Guests for upcoming episodes include the Pulitzer Prize winning poet, Yusef Komunyakaa; Princeton professor Keeanga-Yamahtta Taylor, who is also a contributing writer for The New Yorker, and whose book Race for Profit was a finalist for the 2020 Pulitzer Prize in History; and Gabriel Bryant, who produced the documentary We Breathe, We Live: Brotherly Love Protest Stories. “We Breathe, We Live,” to quote IMDB, “is a film that uses the power of storytelling to present the first-person experiences of men who participated in the Black Lives Matters protests in Philadelphia during the summer of 2020.”

The energy and verve of BGWGTalking is, as Media and communications Professor Gail Ramsey wrote, a “raw, real, intellectual and thought-provoking conversation about deep and explosive issues.”


David A. Love is a professor, journalist and commentator who writes investigative stories and op-eds on a variety of issues, including politics, social justice, human rights, race, criminal justice and inequality. He is a writer for CNN, The AppealtheGrioFirst BoulevardAl Jazeera and In addition, Love’s work has appeared in The Washington PostThe NationThe Guardian and HuffPost, and he has been quoted by The New York TimesTimeNewsweekThe Atlantic and The New Republic.

Love has appeared on CNN, MSNBC, Al Jazeera, BBC, SiriusXM, WURD, CBC News and ABC News Radio (Australian Broadcasting Corporation). He was a producer for Democracy Now! and a contributor to the books, Four Hundred Souls: A Community History of African America, 1619-2019 (2021); States of Confinement: Policing, Detention and Prisons (2000), A Reader for College Writers, 6th Ed. (2004), At the Tea Party (2010) and Current Controversies: The Death Penalty (2015).

Love is an instructor at the Rutgers School of Communication and Information, where he trains students in a social justice journalism lab, and edits and publishes student work for the online publication NJ Spark. He has taught at the Temple University Klein College of Media and Communication in the Media Studies and Production Department.

In addition to his journalism career, Love has worked as an advocate and leader in the nonprofit sector, served as a legislative aide, and as a law clerk to two federal judges. He holds a B.A. in East Asian Studies from Harvard University, and a J.D. from the University of Pennsylvania Law School. He also completed the Joint Programme in International Human Rights Law at the University of Oxford.

Elwyn Laud-Hammond is a 44-year-old black man, who is an activist and Philadelphia native. He is extremely passionate and dedicated to the upliftment of Black people and to having cross racial dialogue about race relations. In August of 2000, he earned a Bachelor of Science in Accounting from Pennsylvania State University. He currently earns his living as Real Estate Appraiser and investor, and as an entrepreneur.  He loves football, boxing, and coaching. He is married and has an 11-year old daughter, who attends a Friends school in Philadelphia. His hope and aspiration for this world is that we try to honestly and openly work on our differences so that we can collectively find ways to create progress for our children and the next generations because that is the true definition of happiness. His mission on this earth now is to be a contributor and to grow with passion.

Zachary Watterson’s stories appear in Chicago Quarterly Review, River Styx, and Commentary’s Summer Fiction. His essays appear in The Paris Review Daily, The Massachusetts ReviewPost Road, and the W.W. Norton anthology called Inheriting the War: Poetry and Prose By Descendants of Vietnam Veterans and Refugees. His work has received a Pushcart Prize nomination, and has been honored in the Best American Essays series. He is the recipient of fellowships from the Elizabeth George Foundation and the Jentel Arts Foundation and work-study scholarships to the Bread Loaf Writers’ Conference. He holds an MFA in fiction from the University of Washington, where he received the Richard Blessing Award and the Eugene Van Buren Prize for Fiction. To support his writing life, and his family, he earns a living in stone masonry.

Aud-cast 43 is right around the corner, so BE ALERT. Thanks as always to the Missouri Review contest editor, Bailey Boyd, and to Patricia Miller, for her generous support for the Miller Audio Prize.

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